Value of John Power & Son 30 Year Old Whiskey

[thomastcat1]

I am hoping some of you guys can help me get an idea of the value of a bottle of whiskey I currently have.

John Power & Son
30 Years Old
John's Lane Distillery
Bottled By Donnelly & Company Ltd., Dublin, No. 8069
Specially Reserved for Donald E. Panoz

Cant Attach a pic as it says its too big unfortunatley.

[thomastcat1]

Managed to resize the pic, hope it helps.

[Good Whiskey Hunting]

That's a nice find. Can you post a picture of the capsule?

[thomastcat1]

That's all there is, not sure what you mean by the capsule, I'm guessing you are referring to a box of some kind?

If so it doesn't have a box other than the one I have it stored in which didn't come with it originally.

Any chance you have any idea of a possible value?

[John]

Hi Thomastcat1,
The request is to basically provide a complete photograph of the entire bottle, not just the lower section. It is important to be able to see the neck, cork, cap and seal.
Regards,
John.

[thomastcat1]

Thanks John. I've attached a pic of the entire bottle below.

[IrishWhiskeyChaser]

Going by the Screw cap it is probably anything from the Late 60's to early 80's.

Wonderful find though, the 30year in the wood is a nice touch and because there is very little of this age in the powers line up it will be worth a good few quid. But where to place a value I cannot guess to start.

Where are you based?

If in the States I think you really need to sell in Europe as I do not think you will realize it's full potential in the US.

[corkriain]

Hello Thomas,
I'd be interested in your Powers bottle and will gladly pay the postage/import costs that otherwise you may have to pay.

I work in Midleton distillery, where we produce Powers whiskey, so I have a particular affection for this brand. I already have a few examples of 1970's/1980's Powers in my collection.

Can you PM me at my E-mail address:

Ericoriain@yahoo.co.uk

[thomastcat1]

Thanks for the replies folks.

From what I have been able to gather so far, the Bottle is early 70's. I have it myself approximately 25 to 30 Years.

It appears to be pretty unique as I have been unable to find a similar bottle so far. It is also an original John's Lane Distillery Whiskey prior to the move to Middleton.

I have been advised it may be best to put it in auction but I have absolutely nothing to go on as regards price etc ( I know auctions are a lottery but would like some idea ).

Eric, working in Middleton, would you be able to shed any light on this bottle for me by any chance?

[Good Whiskey Hunting]

There were a few independents Powers that sold at auction recently for €200-300. I'm not a big fan of these independent. I prefer the distillery bottlings.

NAS Powers are fetching €40/50 and the 15 year old is hovering at €200.

I fear the 30 years in wood would not have done it favours in taste terms but collectors won't worry to much about that.

It's certainly worth as much if not more than the 15 year old. Auctions are risky but can achieve good results.

I'm sure retailers would offer between 2-300 for it which is a good starting point.

Best of luck with it and thanks for sharing this oddity.

[JohnM]

I would say you could get over €1000 for this if you found the right buyer. Very, very rare to find such an aged Powers.

[IrishWhiskeyChaser]

The Irish Whiskey market is a funny one and very hard to predict but as JohnM says this is a very rare whiskey.

Yes should definitely not let it go for less than €500 but in the right conditions could easily fetch multiples of that.

I could see this retailing at €2000 but it is doubtful you'd get that on the private market.

However, IDL(Midleton) themselves may be interested in what a 30yo John's lane Powers would be like so no harm contacting them and see if they want to purchase it.

Otherwise I think you should look into shipping it to whiskyauction.com in germany which seems to be one of the best places for Irish Whiskey, and I could see it going for in excess of the €1000 JohnM mentioned but as you say yourself it is a lottery in ways.

You will also need to look into the costs though as I'm not 100% sure of these.

[thomastcat1]

Many thanks for all the posts and advice folks. It does look like it may be a very special bottle alright. I am looking forward to finding any further information and appreciate all your comments so far.

[Good Whiskey Hunting]

I'll be honest I'd avoid the German Auction site because what you'll gain in price would be taken in commission. It's nearly 20%.

Check them all before you decide. They will range from 5-25%.

A Powers from Cadenheads may get €1500-2000 retail but I couldn't see an independent bottler getting that kind of money. That's retail prices too.
This is rare but more of a curiosity I think. I could be wrong but I don't want Tom to be disappointed if he doesn't get a big price.

I've seen some great price at auctions lately but the higher end ones are disappointing. A Midleton Master Distiller got around £800 and a Jameson from 1917 got $450. Another rare Allmans bottled in Presses got just over £500 I think although I have yet to get evidence. These are bad prices for great whiskeys.
The buyers are still keeping low profiles.

[corkriain]

I think that some of you are seriously over estimating the value of this bottle. Have a look through the history of the auction results in Whiskyauction and you can count three Irish whiskeys that have ever touched the €1000 mark. There have been some serious whiskeys (from closed down distilleries) auctioned there:

Jameson Cadenhead €762
Tullamore Cadenhead €1068
Midleton 26 Year Olds - €500 - €1000
Dungourney 1964 - €450
William Jameson - €660
Old Tullamore Dews (Standard to 8 year olds): €50 - €200

A 34 Year Old Kilbeggan sold for €613 in 2013 but had documented pedigree.

Original John Power pot still whiskeys from Johns Lane are ranging from €122 to €235 (2014). The Powers 15 Year Old blend from John's Lane (1970's) can be had for about €200. Other blends from this distillery can be had for €30 to €40.

I understand that this is certainly a bit different. However, it is not a Cadenhead which have pedigree and proper records to back up the claim for the age of the whiskeys. The valuations you are quoting are comparing it to these whiskeys.

I have been trying to get more information to prove the pedigree of this bottle but have not been able to achieve this yet. I have no doubt it is a genuine White label. However, it is a quite recent bottle and I've never come across this type of red labelling on any other Powers before. The problem is that it is a bottler or bonder bottling and, unlike ongoing blenders like Cadenhead, records are unfortunately extinct.

For all these reasons I think some of these valuations are getting a bit ridiculous. I understand they are retail estimates but please bear in mind that a 27 year old Bow Street distillery Cadenhead Jameson (always higher auction and retail prices for Jameson's and Cadenheads) can be bought from a retail shop for the bones of €1500. That would mean a €600 to €750 on the collector market!

[thomastcat1]

Just in relation to your appraisal of this bottle in your post - 'Original John Power pot still whiskeys from Johns Lane are ranging from €122 to €235 (2014)', are these 30 year old pot still whiskeys, from the original Johns Lane Distillery?

'I understand that this is certainly a bit different. However, it is not a Cadenhead which have pedigree and proper records to back up the claim for the age of the whiskeys.' Does this mean that this bottle of Powers could never be classed as good as a Cadenhead? and if so, is this based on the paperwork being available/unavailable for the bottles or the actual whiskey itself?

' However, it is a quite recent bottle' - What exactly does this mean? -and are you saying this bottle of whiskey could not be a 30 Year old Powers?

'The problem is that it is a bottler or bonder bottling and, unlike ongoing blenders like Cadenhead, records are unfortunately extinct' - I don't think this can be stated so definitely. Records may not be available in Middletons archives but that is not to say that records may exist elsewhere,.

'I have no doubt it is a genuine White label' - can you expand on this a little bit more as to what exactly the significance of this is?

[JohnM]

Well, it's a matter of opinion, of course, but old Irish whiskey bottles have regularly gone for over £1,000 in UK auctions. Even half bottles have received very large prices. And these are bottles that have come up again and again. This one has not come up before, as far as I know. And there are very few Irish whiskeys with such great age, especially from this era.

There are less Irish whiskey collectors than collectors of Scotch or Japanese, but when a new whiskey comes up and they're all going for it, it tends to achieve very high prices. Once everyone has one, the price can collapse.

I also know of old Irish whiskeys that have changed hands privately for several thousand euros.

But if this goes up for auction, we'll have a better idea of what it's worth. Maybe you're right.

[Good Whiskey Hunting]

Well, it's a matter of opinion, of course, but old Irish whiskey bottles have regularly gone for over £1,000 in UK auctions. Even half bottles have received very large prices. And these are bottles that have come up again and again. This one has not come up before, as far as I know. And there are very few Irish whiskeys with such great age, especially from this era.

There are less Irish whiskey collectors than collectors of Scotch or Japanese, but when a new whiskey comes up and they're all going for it, it tends to achieve very high prices. Once everyone has one, the price can collapse.

I also know of old Irish whiskeys that have changed hands privately for several thousand euros.

But if this goes up for auction, we'll have a better idea of what it's worth. Maybe you're right.

I see your point John. Those Redbreast 5 Oz bottlers were a good example of collectors going nuts over a bottle that was probably worth a fraction of the hammer price.

[corkriain]

Points taken, I can see where you're coming from as. It is certainly an interesting bottle with a great deal of mystery attached. Perhaps that is as much a driver of value as the age statement.

It is also true, as you say, that luck plays a part in auctions which depends heavily on who is interested and engaged at the time of sale. A Jameson 15 Year Old sold for just over £100 at auction recently and we'd all estimate that at probably £300 to £400 at this stage! And on the flip side some Redbreast 1970's miniatures sold for ridiculous money way above what anyone would have estimated beforehand.

I'd like to investigate the bottle more perhaps with your help.

Do any of you have info on Donnelly & Company Limited, the bottlers of the whiskey?

[thomastcat1]

Yes it would be great if anyone knows anything about the bottlers Donnelly & Co. Also if anyone has any details of a bonded warehouse company by the name of Rockwell Warehouse Limited which closed in 1972 and apparently had the Company number 8069 which is the number printed on the label of this bottle.

The reference on the label 'specially reserved for Donald E. Panoz' is referring to a US Businessman who started a company in Ireland in 1969 according to Wikipedia which would tie in with the era of The Bonded warehouse Rockwell warehouse limited.

I Really appreciate all the various views and information so far folks.